PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:12 AM |
An Open Letter of Response to the WIJ argument,
The WIJ argument of winning the war early based on charges of admin abuse as based on the original rules is not well founded and actually very much ignoring important aspects of their rules. As a result they have chosen to hold an unofficial final battle after saying they prematurely won when no rules were actually broken by John's Cobras. In addition, they claim that their raid wins justify this matter and this too is false. I therefore advocate that either WIJ hold the battle they promised to on the 20th, or their actions be viewed as retreat from a war before the official terms were met, therefore resulting in a JC conditional victory over WIJ.
Lets start with the first aspect of the charges of Admin Abuse. This is often the first argument a WIJ will jump to in justifying the actions of HICOM in declaring victory. First it should be clear the exact rules as specified by WIJ at this link:
http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=94171552
The rules clearly say TWICE:
"Targeted exploits and admin abusing will not be tolerated by either side. "
"*EXPLOITING IS NATURALLY NOT PERMITTED, NOR IS ADMIN ABUSE IN ANY FORM. IF WE HAVE FIRM EVIDENCE OF EITHER SIDE SUPPORTING THIS PRACTICE, THE WAR WILL CEASE." (Silentswords)
You will notice very clearly that both of these rules suggest that Admin Abuse will NOT BE TOLERATED or SUPPORTED. This indicates that if admin abuse is occurring, but PSPJohn is perfectly capable of doing something about it and still doesn't, it can be a problem. It should also be noted that PSPJohn is on vacation at this time and has been contacting his high ranks via phone. Unless he were to compromise his account, action would not be able to be taken on this matter, and thus it is unclear whether the admin abuse is supported or not. If Owen or SS would like to suggest that his account should be compromised to take action quickly, I will be filing a report of rule breaking to roblox. That is simply far too much to ask of someone who is on vacation.
It should also be pointed out that JC HAS IN FACT DEMOTED/REMOVED ADMIN ABUSERS. This would indicate that they do not support the practice, and those who are admin abusing now are simply still there because PSPJohn cannot reach a computer.
Furthermore the action of a BarbarianZ which ended the war on conditional terms according to SilentSwords and Owen (http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=94466881) makes the assumption that said action was in fact Admin Abuse and therefore ends the war.
However, he CLEARLY AND PUBLICLY admits that he already had surrendered before shutting down and was just clearing a finished raid. (http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=94474960)
This is clearly not admin ABUSE, which is the action of using admin commands to influence the outcome of a raid or defense. In this case the raid was already clearly over in favor of WIJ and the server was shut down by the admin to start a new one.
In these examples it can be established that JC has not in fact broken any of the terms set up by WIJ in their war as written by SilentSwords.
BECAUSE OF THIS FAULTY ASSUMPTION, WIJ found it appropriate to break their agreement by claiming "conditional victory" and then "kindly offered" JC the chance to still win via a Final Battle. In the original rules a final battle is called for,
"As discussed with PspJohn the war will be decided by a final battle. This battle is to a streamed RCL 8v8 at Bricktops and is to take place on the evening (GMT) of Sat 20th April. "
This date was discussed with PSPJohn and probably occurs when he is back from vacation (uncited and unknown, my guess). For some reason WIJ decided they could twist the rules without the permission of the JC Leader and offer a final battle while he was on vacation. Despite what the high ranks of JC may agree to without PSPJohn, the final decision is in fact made by the leader of the clan and not his high ranks.
SilentSwords seems to agree with this type of point, that his word is law in the end, as he stated about his own high rank, "I never used the term 'only for prestige' myself. Owen did that. But owen is not incharge of WIJ officially, I am." (http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=94562248) ^^^(A really great argument between me and SS in this thread)
It therefore does not appear that JC backed out of an unofficial Final Battle with WIJ, but that WIJ was trapping JC with little notice, lack of official leadership, and different rules than WIJ initially created.
They argue that because JC "backed out," they win the war, after all they had an incredible superiority of raid wins against JC and that MUST prove it.
I draw your attention back to the original rules posted by SilentSwords
" Raids are fought for prestige and will cease the day before the final battle. Final raidlist (with imgur links for each individual raids) will be sent to the opposing side for confirmation. Only raids with raidcodes clearly visible in the image will be valid and counted. Final raidcount confirmed by both sides will be released on Fri 19th April. "
And while he denies this fact later,
"I never used the term 'only for prestige' myself. Owen did that. But owen is not incharge of WIJ officially, I am."
It is clearly available for public eyes here: http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=94171552
Furthermore this raid win superiority stands on the assumption that WIJ actually has the power to negate the JC Victories from before the war, some reports totaling around 40 or so wins for JC. WIJ doesn't have the right to write off a preemptive strike against it and should be able to defend its forts regardless of war status. Still, if this was discussed between PSPJohn and SS, and PSP agreed that his raids would not count, then this is a nonissue. I would like to see chatlogs regarding the agreement made public.
If WIJ is still to claim that their war terms justified them breaking their own rules, I am willing to prove otherwise. At this point based on the very publicly clear guidelines posted by WIJ, JC has not deserved the defeat and should have until April 20th to train for a Final Battle. If THIS condition is satisfied then WIJ can claim victory, until then they are simply backing out of their own war.
Maybe its attrition. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:13 AM |
| couldnt be bothered reading. here for the lulz. umad |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:13 AM |
Sherlock holmes did it again |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:14 AM |
we're fighting JC when they come up to us with a team
people making a big deal out of all of this are either anti wij or idiots |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:14 AM |
BarbarianZ was lying. I have chatlogs, screenshots and videos showing JC HRs actively supported admin abuse. All you have is speculation.
We've won, JC are free to challenge that on the 20th if they see fit. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:15 AM |
umad umad umad
HAIL COBRAS!!
[][][][][][][[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][ |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:15 AM |
| You cannot determine what the intentions of the leader are until the leader publicly announces them or takes action. In this case PSPJohn is unable to take action, and regardless of BarbarianZ's motivations if PSPJohn doesn't support the admin abuse then JC doesn't support the admin abuse. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
Celestus
|
  |
| Joined: 15 Aug 2011 |
| Total Posts: 14873 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:16 AM |
'couldnt be bothered reading. here for the lulz. umad'
Reported for off-topic spam.
'people making a big deal out of all of this are either anti wij or idiots'
Expand, if your only argument for criticism is either anti-WIJ or idiot it is quite self explanatory.
|
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:16 AM |
tl;dr
The lonely sentinel.. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
JuHDude
|
  |
| Joined: 15 Nov 2010 |
| Total Posts: 519 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:16 AM |
| Like seriously, everyone is making a big fuss out of this.. yet again. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:17 AM |
The HRs were in contact with PspJohn over the affair, the HRs also made clear to me they would not be taking action against repeat offenders because it wasn't a big deal.
I have evidence, you have nothing. The real argument against WIJ is that they brought the FB forward. Your trying to argue JC didn't support AA? Good luck kiddo. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
pandatoby
|
  |
| Joined: 01 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 10351 |
|
| |
|
Celestus
|
  |
| Joined: 15 Aug 2011 |
| Total Posts: 14873 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:18 AM |
| Please supply the evidence, otherwise you cannot use the claimed to be existent evidence in an argument. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:19 AM |
If you have evidence please release it so we can all see it. Otherwise you don't have anything. Even if the high ranks were IN CONTACT with PSPJohn, he couldn't have done anything about it unless he had a means to access roblox, and while on vacation without a computer that is not possible.
Even your own leader recognized that you don't have the power to make the final decision, he does. The same applies to JC. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:19 AM |
All information has been released multiple times before, did you guys actually read/look at/watch any of it?
imgur or youtube:
/Z8qOoKm.jpg /ucCkYmM.jpg /XVPzojE.jpg /watch?v=4vyYW-XqZTw /asGwULK.jpg /QbqFExj.jpg
1:13:38 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: Yes, [1:13:41 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: he shutdown a server. [1:13:43 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: But really, [1:13:45 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: he is a good HR. [1:13:49 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: Admin can be dealt with. [1:14:07 PM] Matthew: He said he'd never do it again. [1:14:11 PM] Matthew: Look what happened! [1:14:17 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: Matthew, [1:14:20 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: [SWEARING]
[JC General] Verodoxys: To be totally honest, [JC General] Verodoxys: ABSOLUTELY, 100% honest, [JC General] Verodoxys: I believe WIJ should win this war. [JC General] Verodoxys: On the claims and PROOF [JC General] Verodoxys: Of EXTREME AA of JC HRs. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
pandatoby
|
  |
| Joined: 01 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 10351 |
|
| |
|
PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:21 AM |
| Im sorry can you edit your roblox scripts on your phone? I know I can't. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:22 AM |
@Owen
This would actually show that the JC generals do not support admin abuse.
They even say that they will deal with the admin in question [1:13:49 PM] -[OMEGA EXECUTIVE|PRIME OPS TROLL|FIRST IN COMMAND X1PRO]-: Admin can be dealt with.
I don't see how this proves JC supports admin abuse in its clan. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:22 AM |
Face it, you two are just trying to bring us down by arguing about something so pointless and miniscule.
The only thing to be achieved from extending such an argument would be to bring WIJ down, and if you're so desperate that you're writing full length novels on the subject, then you're clearly just anti-WIJ, for whatever reason. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:23 AM |
| Actually that conversation was about them refusing to demote him. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
PLOOBER33
|
  |
| Joined: 30 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 7513 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:23 AM |
| @Panda to be fair it doesn't even necessarily mean internet connection. I only last month upgraded from a flip phone that didn't get internet access, let alone running any apps capable of reaching roblox. |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:23 AM |
You also claimed Barbarian was legitimatly shutting down the server. My half dozen screens and video evidence says otherwise.
|
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|
pandatoby
|
  |
| Joined: 01 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 10351 |
|
| |
|
Virtuosic
|
  |
| Joined: 16 Mar 2013 |
| Total Posts: 4413 |
|
| |
|
owen0202
|
  |
| Joined: 27 Feb 2008 |
| Total Posts: 6912 |
|
|
| 12 Apr 2013 11:25 AM |
tl;dr lie speculation lie moot point
WIJ have already agreed that JC are welcome to contest the verdict in another battle... |
|
|
| Report Abuse |
|
|