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Re: What does "knowing" a programming language really mean?

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Techboy6601 is not online. Techboy6601
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Total Posts: 4914
03 Feb 2013 03:45 PM
Literally speaking, knowing an entire programming language is impossible to know in the same way that knowing the entirety of math is impossible: you can't know everything about it until you've done everything with it. As an example, in math, you can't know 4763 x 765 unless you've gotten the answer before (and even then, you have to remember it). However, as we all know, the amount of things you can do with a reasonably advanced programming language is probably infinite.

The reason for this thread is as a response to the "they'll just use the wiki" argument for wiki writer applications, LuaLearners rank ups, scripting tests for the forums, and other things requiring the knowledge of scripting.

Is this argument valid? I know that personally I can't get much far into anything programming related without having some form of wiki/forum/video tutorial handy. Whether it's for learning a new concept, remembering certain techniques, or just for debugging errors, I simply can't work well without these tools. However, what I will say is that I am adequately able to use these concepts and skills once I understand them.

Does that make me a beginner or an advanced scripter? I guess that's a personal opinion. So I want to hear yours.

Discuss.

---
Kaa's Law: In any sufficiently large group of people most are idiots.
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Garnished is not online. Garnished
Joined: 09 Apr 2012
Total Posts: 12695
03 Feb 2013 03:52 PM
>knowing a programming

what.
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popdosprlte is not online. popdosprlte
Joined: 18 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 4801
03 Feb 2013 03:55 PM
In the same way that knowing English means you speak it fluently and understand it's structure, programming is nigh identical.

You don't have to know every word of English to speak it, and you don't need to know every method to program.



~p͈̭̫̫̼͛ͫ́̽͝o͇͇͉ͩͪͬͮͯ͋͊p͎ͤ͢͏̷̛̻̺̦̫̮̳̲̲̱̰̯̮̜̤̹̿̆̈̊̌̚͟͠d͙͙͙͙͛͛͆͆͆͊͊͊͋͋͋͋͌͌͌̿̿̿̿̽̽͟͟͞͞͞͠͠͡͡͡͞͝o̧̧͎͎͎̺̺̺̺̦̦̦̗ͦͦͦͣ̓̓̓̅̅̄̄͢͢͢s̴̴̴̵̵̶̶̷̷̷̸͇͇͇̳̳̳ͬͭͮͮͯͯ͛͛͛p͇̾̾̿̿̀̀́͂̓̈́̈́r̸̸̷̵̵̹͌i̗̓̅̅ẗ̳̳͇́̈́̈́̓̓̓͂͂͂́́̀̀̀̿ͅͅͅe͇͇͉͉͍͈͈͇͇᷂᷂͆͆͋͋͌͌̈́̈́᷾᷈᷈᷇᷇᷆᷆᷅᷅᷅᷄᷄᷃᷃͝͝͞͞ͅͅ
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kungfuman32 is not online. kungfuman32
Joined: 12 Dec 2008
Total Posts: 9172
03 Feb 2013 04:31 PM
Pop, you can have this thread.
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Tenal is not online. Tenal
Joined: 15 May 2011
Total Posts: 18684
03 Feb 2013 04:40 PM
Sometimes I wonder if I memorize snippets or I actually know the language.
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zars15 is not online. zars15
Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Total Posts: 9999
03 Feb 2013 04:55 PM
I know how programming works in Lua, but for C++ I kind of know it, but probably I think about snipets.
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thek00lkid is not online. thek00lkid
Joined: 18 Jun 2011
Total Posts: 2778
03 Feb 2013 05:34 PM
Even professionals research on the job, for you'll never learn all of a language's entirety, especially when it comes to libraries.
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awsumpwner27 is not online. awsumpwner27
Joined: 03 Sep 2011
Total Posts: 4389
03 Feb 2013 06:40 PM
Knowing the language means being able to apply it for its purpose.
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Techboy6601 is not online. Techboy6601
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Total Posts: 4914
03 Feb 2013 06:43 PM
"Knowing the language means being able to apply it for its purpose."

With or without external help?

---
Kaa's Law: In any sufficiently large group of people most are idiots.
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awsumpwner27 is not online. awsumpwner27
Joined: 03 Sep 2011
Total Posts: 4389
03 Feb 2013 06:47 PM
External help is irrelevant.

You cannot know a language unless you learned it, and the knowledge doesn't manifest from nothing. You need some form of help.
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Techboy6601 is not online. Techboy6601
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Total Posts: 4914
03 Feb 2013 06:50 PM
Well then, it looks like you just won this thread.

Congratulations.

---
Kaa's Law: In any sufficiently large group of people most are idiots.
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BrandonFireflower is not online. BrandonFireflower
Joined: 09 Feb 2010
Total Posts: 731
03 Feb 2013 07:04 PM
A programming language is syntax and core functions, not everything possible with it. To know how to multiply, you don't need to know the answer to every single problem possible.
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SecureDatabase is not online. SecureDatabase
Joined: 12 Dec 2010
Total Posts: 392
03 Feb 2013 08:15 PM
I think "knowing" something depends on your ability to utilize and apply the language or talent in general.

So to "Know" Lua, you have to be able to use it and utilize it effectively.
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ENET is not online. ENET
Joined: 01 Jan 2010
Total Posts: 4820
03 Feb 2013 08:47 PM
I've made every game possible. I wrote to memory every possible combination a computer could handle. Thus every possible program that could be made. For example a 2 byte computer would have:

0 0
0 1
0 2
0 3
0 4
0 5
0 6
...and many later...
1 0
1 1
1 2
1 3
1 4
...until every combination possible is filled.

Are you jealous? Wouldn't it be a wonderful to get to test all those programs? Perphaps one is a super amazing version of packman?
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