pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 02:57 PM |
Then Explain
the Soviet Union
Poland
Czechoslovakia
Hungary
Yugoslavia
Romania
Bulgaria
Eastern Germany
Albania
South Yemen
Somalia
Ethiopia
Madagascar
Benin
Eritrea
Angola
Mozambique
Afghanistan
People's Republic of Congo
China
Laos
Vietnam
Cambodia
Cuba
North Korea
Every single on of these states have used communism as the form of economy, and every single one has seen it fail, some may not have admitted it yet but it results in the same outcome. Totalitarian rule, State terror, Extreme poverty, and the lack of civil freedoms.
People may been equal in poverty wise, but they are also all slaves to the state. Of course communism includes a stateless society, but how are you to do this without the state? You cant, which is why communism cant work in its pure form. This is what happens when you put equality before freedom, you end up with this.
What communism requires is the perfection of humanity, which is exactly what Robespierre, Hitlol, Lenin, Stalin, pol pot or any of the communist, fascist or totalitarian dictators wanted.
This is why any country, the Netherlands, Britain, Canada, America have become some of the most influential countries in the world. They put freedom before equality but then they end up with a great excess of both. Every individual is then free to make their own choices to decide their destiny. If a small group of people wish to live in a commune, thats fine with them as long as it doesn't interfere with the individual decisions of anyone else. If you compare the life style of those living in a commune and one that lives in free enterprise, who is going to have the better life style? Go on to google images and look up New York, you see an endless amount of pictures of a shinning city that is the modern heart of Capitalism. Now look up Commune, not the type of place you would like to live. Rather, most of those pitchers have people that dont even have a roof over their head. This is why Free Trade has become the only system that has made the Human race expand further beyond our wildest dreams.
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| 25 Jul 2012 03:12 PM |
Every single on of these states have used communism as the form of economy,
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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAaaaaaaa.... |
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| 25 Jul 2012 07:57 PM |
| Pepper, this is an honest question: Do you even do your research? Do you? These were SOCIALIST states, Socialism is a state that takes place before communism, communism has no state. |
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| 25 Jul 2012 07:59 PM |
| Pepper, you must be special, these are all Bolshevik Socialist nations. |
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:00 PM |
| Also, the only time Czechoslovakia was communist was when it was part of the soviet union. |
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:32 PM |
@Cheese
These are countries that openly declared themselves to be communist. The socialist nations would make the list bigger
Also Czechoslovakia was NEVER part of the Soviet Union, maybe a puppet state but never under soviet sovereignty. |
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:37 PM |
| Just because they claim they're communist, doesn't make them. Just because Greece calls itself democratic, that doesn't make it democratic. |
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pepper0
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:40 PM |
| Having a communist 'state' is just not possible. They tried and failed every single time. |
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:41 PM |
True communism doesn't have a state, or the "state" is void and useless.
Try again |
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Raximus
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| 25 Jul 2012 08:52 PM |
| Communism = Not real I refuse to beleive something like that exists |
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 09:31 PM |
@Dr
EXACTLY
THose countries have tried communism and have failed, partly because of that key factor of communism is ignored.
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 09:36 PM |
| Therefore the only places you can see real communism closest to its pure form in communes. However, members of that commune do not renounce their citizenship to their country, as far as im aware of, therefore has to conduct the duties of a citizen when called. Like to serve on a Jury, called in the Army, to Vote or any thing else. |
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jbg23
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| 25 Jul 2012 09:55 PM |
Pepper, this is an honest question: Do you even do your research? Do you? These were SOCIALIST states, Socialism is a state that takes place before communism, communism has no state.
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Even that's a stretch. Most of these were command economies. |
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jbg23
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| 25 Jul 2012 09:56 PM |
These are countries that openly declared themselves to be communist.
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And you believed them? xD |
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 09:59 PM |
Your saying they never did?
You sir, are denying history that happened. |
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jbg23
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| 25 Jul 2012 10:14 PM |
I don't deny that they declared themselves to be communist.
I deny that these states ever achieved anything close to communism. The mere existence of the State in these matters reinforces that. |
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jbg23
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| 25 Jul 2012 10:17 PM |
A few rare ones could be considered partly socialist.
The others were just ordinary command economies, with rulers who spent all say laughing, "AND THEN WE TOLD THEM WE WERE COMMUNISTS!!!!! xD" |
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pepper0
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| 25 Jul 2012 10:24 PM |
Possibility. But that still doesn't stop the fact that what they wanted to achieve failed.
In Cambodia, they abolished money, basically stopped foreign trade and foreign relations, the key elements of capitalism.
One reason why they had a totalitarian regime so they can create the new man. So they can 'get rid' of those who where considered 'a threat' to the development of communism.
Thats the only way communism can truly work, for humanity to be perfect, which it isn't. Human action is not predictable, it is chaotic. |
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| 25 Jul 2012 10:57 PM |
Possibility. But that still doesn't stop the fact that what they wanted to achieve failed.
In Cambodia, they abolished money, basically stopped foreign trade and foreign relations, the key elements of capitalism.
One reason why they had a totalitarian regime so they can create the new man. So they can 'get rid' of those who where considered 'a threat' to the development of communism.
Thats the only way communism can truly work, for humanity to be perfect, which it isn't. Human action is not predictable, it is chaotic.
________
What they wanted to achieve failed at least in part because they were idiots about doing it. Classical economics largely believes that socialism (and later communism, unless you aren't into the whole transition stage thing) is best and only attempted after a sound capitalist economic base is established. Communist theorists largely agree that abolishing money first is the wrong order of things; ethnic cleansing is not communist in any way.
You say that human action is chaotic.
I'll let you take that one up with Adam Smith.
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| 26 Jul 2012 12:19 AM |
| They *called* themselves communist. Okay I'm going to *call*myself pepper0: (pseudo intellectual pro American, pro capitalism, reactionary crap) |
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| 26 Jul 2012 12:33 AM |
there is a thing called "being in name only", sort of like Westboro Baptist, they aren't.
or the Japanese Communist Party, communists disown them as Baptists disown Westboro. |
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