shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 07:47 PM |
ah yes, nothing like killing the world's largest economy with wealth redistribution and even more bureaucracy (which is what is bringing this country down to its knees)
If you want to see this so called "income inequality" go away, lessen the hold of the government on the people's lives, tell career politicians to screw off by taking away their pay and benefits, and you'll see change |
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redlego98
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| Joined: 11 Jul 2008 |
| Total Posts: 8870 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 07:49 PM |
Ah yes, please, give us income equality, I have always wanted to live in a communist nation, not.
A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. |
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Stitching
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| Joined: 04 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 145 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 07:49 PM |
how is wealth redistribution the problem
also do you know what has caused the lower class to revolt historically |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 07:57 PM |
"how is wealth redistribution the problem"
If we took everyone's money away from them, and gave it to other people, even people who didn't work as hard as them, what do you think would happen to work ethic?
"also do you know what has caused the lower class to revolt historically"
And those were mostly in countries where the government was complete aristocracy and was more feudal than capitalistic |
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| 15 Aug 2015 07:59 PM |
"how is wealth redistribution the problem"
I live in a country that suffered from wealth distribution it's not fun to get the assets someone worked their ass off for taken away and given out as if they were nothing |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:00 PM |
@Max
What country was that, may I ask? |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:01 PM |
Nicaragua
I come from a family with huge land assets |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:03 PM |
I get money from the government
but it's pretty helpful considering my family has financial problems |
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Stitching
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| Joined: 04 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 145 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:05 PM |
"If we took everyone's money away from them, and gave it to other people, even people who didn't work as hard as them, what do you think would happen to work ethic?"
if you know what one man earns in a week/month and realize that you and your extended family will not even see that much money over several generations, what do you think happens to work ethic?
more importantly, what about the people who without welfare wouldn't even be able to eat?
you may retort with bootstraps rhetoric, but not everybody can be part of the .01%
welfare needs regulation, but overall i am surprised that the possibility for food to appear on some family's table should be a demoralizing factor for workers
"And those were mostly in countries where the government was complete aristocracy and was more feudal than capitalistic"
and if you live in the west, you live in a bureaucratic oligarchy which is pretty similar |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:10 PM |
though I'd probably enjoy a classless society
where no one can be rich or poor |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:10 PM |
"if you know what one man earns in a week/month and realize that you and your extended family will not even see that much money over several generations, what do you think happens to work ethic?"
I know quite a bit of people who are from immigrant families and aren't discouraged by that fact, it makes them want to try harder.
"more importantly, what about the people who without welfare wouldn't even be able to eat?"
There's a difference between wealth redistribution and welfare.
"you may retort with bootstraps rhetoric, but not everybody can be part of the .01%"
Not everyone can. But I do hope you know that you don't have to be in the .01% to be rich, the United States has a good number of multi millionaires in it
"welfare needs regulation, but overall i am surprised that the possibility for food to appear on some family's table should be a demoralizing factor for workers"
Again, wealth redistribution =/= welfare. You pay taxes, a bit of the money goes into welfare, and it goes to people in need, which is just fine. Wealth redistribution is where you get all your money taken from you and you probably never see it again
"and if you live in the west, you live in a bureaucratic oligarchy which is pretty similar"
But can I vote for people? Yes. Can I speak out against politicians? Yes. Am I able to rise on the food chain by working hard? Yes.
In an aristocratic feudal society, you can't do neither of those.
Stop comparing apples to oranges |
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Stitching
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| Joined: 04 Oct 2011 |
| Total Posts: 145 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 08:27 PM |
"I know quite a bit of people who are from immigrant families and aren't discouraged by that fact, it makes them want to try harder."
ok well one can probably find similar exceptions to your claim that wealth redistribution lowers work ethic
"Not everyone can. But I do hope you know that you don't have to be in the .01% to be rich, the United States has a good number of multi millionaires in it"
oh my bad, the 1%
"Again, wealth redistribution =/= welfare. You pay taxes, a bit of the money goes into welfare, and it goes to people in need, which is just fine."
ok glad we can agree on something
"Wealth redistribution is where you get all your money taken from you and you probably never see it again"
something like this does not exist in the US unless one is very good at playing the system
people are not buying condos in Florida with foodstamps
your money gets taken from you and then you see it again in the form of roads, schools, bridges, police and fire departments, and public employees
yes there is government waste but there are few advocating for that
"But can I vote for people? Yes. Can I speak out against politicians? Yes. Am I able to rise on the food chain by working hard? Yes.
In an aristocratic feudal society, you can't do neither of those.
Stop comparing apples to oranges"
see: china and the civil service exam
you need to somehow pay tens of thousands of dollars to get a degree so you can be qualified to get a good job (excluding entrepreneur work)
we're not a caste-based society, but i do not believe the idea that sweat has infinite purchasing parity in the US.
i admit i am not honestly sure what we are arguing about anymore. what does the fact that i can vote have to do with whether wealth redistribution is good or bad?
i will help you since i think you missed the memo: people revolted historically when they could not afford bread.
my original premise was an argument for welfare, which i thought you meant by wealth redistribution; if you mean wealth redistribution as in communism, i really have no idea where you're coming from since the US is far from communist |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:24 PM |
>"ah yes, nothing like killing the world's largest economy with wealth redistribution and even more bureaucracy (which is what is bringing this country down to its knees)"
Bureaucracy is the opposite of wealth distribution. And bureaucracy is what has destroyed the US's economy.
Scandinavian countries like Sweden and Norway have significantly better economies yet significantly more wealth redistribution.
>"If you want to see this so called "income inequality" go away, lessen the hold of the government on the people's lives, tell career politicians to screw off by taking away their pay and benefits, and you'll see change"
It's like you love the government and corporations but you also hate them at the same time. |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:24 PM |
| I love when 14 year olds act like they know better than economists. |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:25 PM |
And the millionaire household thing might not sound like a lot, but there are usually many people living in a house, so the number of millionaires in the US could be higher than you think.
Not to mention that the study excluded people's primary residences, where if they were included, the number of households and millionaires could be much higher
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:26 PM |
>"I love when 14 year olds act like they know better than economists."
Uh
I'm pretty sure all of us could find many economists who agree with us. Economics is like history. Barely anyone actually agrees with each other. |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:27 PM |
| If you think everyone has equal opportunity in the United States today, then oh boy, do I have some news for you... |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:28 PM |
"Bureaucracy is the opposite of wealth distribution. And bureaucracy is what has destroyed the US's economy."
Last time I checked Bureaucracy and wealth redistribution involve heavy government intervention
"Scandinavian countries like Sweden and Norway have significantly better economies yet significantly more wealth redistribution."
There's a few reasons. 1. Their populations are freaking tiny 2. Everyone works (For the moment) 3. Economy is no where near the size of the US's 4. They have a source such as oil to base everything off of 5. Most of Europe spends little to nothing on defense since the US has been in Europe since WW2
"It's like you love the government and corporations but you also hate them at the same time."
Since when does advocating less government regulations, which kill small businesses (good for corporations!) and advocating for the lessing of legislature benefits make me that? |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:29 PM |
"If you think everyone has equal opportunity in the United States today, then oh boy, do I have some news for you..."
Oh I know not everyone has equal opportunity, but there is opportunity. And sitting on your computer complaining about unequal opportunity doesn't help |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:30 PM |
daily reminder that the reason women "make less" than men is because they have leave and usually take less-paying jobs
if women started taking classes on science and engineering instead of womens rights and literature this wouldnt be happening |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:31 PM |
| Actually less government regulations have historically lead to monopolies and corporations gobbling up smaller businesses while abusing workers financially. |
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shawnz98
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| Joined: 10 Jul 2015 |
| Total Posts: 477 |
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| 15 Aug 2015 09:40 PM |
"Actually less government regulations have historically lead to monopolies and corporations gobbling up smaller businesses while abusing workers financially."
Those days were anarchy, and the government was in on the corporations abusing the people
We need some laws, but regulations these days are insane
Too little and too much regulations are bad |
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