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Re: A Discussion on the Stagnation of Clans

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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:35 PM
As observed over the past few years, general opinion towards clan clans has increasingly gone south. No longer are we in an age of progression, as these people claim, and many leaders have stated their belief that clans are hopeless. Having all been involved in one clan or any other, we each have our own opinions on when the 'glory days' of clans were, but let's discuss some factors that have contributed to this feeling of decline, and perhaps we can be idealists for a bit and offer some wacky solutions.

First of all, in my opinion, the biggest factor in the decline of clans is our unwillingness to participate in what war clans are really about: war. Many will try to claim that it is instead ROBLOX developers lack of care for the clan world - but I disagree. We have always functioned without ROBLOX-aided features (save the most basic of group features..like...groups...), and ROBLOX has shown that the features they do add are minimalistic at best. Let's be honest, was the Clan feature really something that revolutionized the clan world? No. In fact, it is my belief that if ROBLOX developers got involved, it would make the situation worse. A structural framework offered by admins for a way to organize wars and whatnot would likely be the most useful thing, (the 'territory' idea was a decent concept) but let's be realistic: it would likely be met with too much opposition by clan leaders who are content with the status quo, and it may be too complex for us to even use effectively. So let's get back to what war clans are actually about.

In a past time, as many of us remember, clans mainly went to war for the sake of going to war. Battles were held, they were fought, and they were enjoyed. It mattered little who 'won' or who 'lost' for the most part, and as I recall, things were generally a lot less political. Granted, we were all younger back then. For the veterans who can sympathize, we were all kids who could not fathom what politics were. Growing older, we began to put restrictions on things, and clans began to get caught in a cobweb of political schemes. We began to fight with harsher rhetoric, greater use of ad hominem. Arguments would be fought over schematics, and it would seem that half of our battles would simply be fought with negative words, something that, quite frankly I believe, has led to the destruction of our community.

If we are war clans, why do we persist to act like real political entities? Why must we bicker and fight over terms that do not exist? And if we persist on maintaining a political atmosphere in conjunction with clans, why do we not have an official body of regulation? Such questions present themselves when we talk about clans and their downfalls. Wars today have become less of a fun way for the clan to commit towards a common goal, and more a show of bravado of who can argue the best.

Secondly, in my opinion, the clan world is dissolving because there are rarely new clans. Clans that are being created for the most part are largely led by the same leaders, or exist as recycled versions of older clans. New leaders, in my opinion, are becoming discouraged from making clans because of the dissociation of fun that has come with leading a clan. New leaders are met with harsh criticism, fierce flame on the forums, and new leaders without connections who show promise are generally ostracized by veterans. Power-clans are being created at a rapid rate ,only to fall shortly after. This cycle of creation and destruction is likely to also contribute to a leader's disinterest in making a clan, as they ask themselves "What's the point? Why should I spend hours making something only to have it destroyed the next week?"

With all this in mind, in my opinion, the only way that the clan world can actually progress, is if we take measured steps as a collective body to progress. Clan lines aside, we all generally are involved in war clans for the same unified purpose. In my opinion, C&G, as a group, needs to come together and come up with creative solutions to amend the problems of the day. If C&G refuses to cooperate with each other for the sake of clans, clans shall continue to exist in a perpetual state before eventually succumbing to an accumulation of problems.

Feel free to discuss your opinions on this. I will likely provide my own insight and solutions, but honestly, take a read. I'm interested in what you all think.


~am a cat meow~

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Basketor is not online. Basketor
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Total Posts: 55543
06 Jan 2015 05:35 PM
VAK still #1
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PracticeTheGod is not online. PracticeTheGod
Joined: 17 Dec 2014
Total Posts: 40
06 Jan 2015 05:36 PM
[ Content Deleted ]
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ShatteredQuantum is not online. ShatteredQuantum
Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Total Posts: 38600
06 Jan 2015 05:36 PM
crak how long did it take you to write this >______________>
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RecurringNightmare is not online. RecurringNightmare
Joined: 05 Jul 2012
Total Posts: 15336
06 Jan 2015 05:38 PM
clans are stagnant
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:38 PM
"VAK still #1"

Perhaps you could keep individual loyalties aside and listen to what I'm trying to say before posting uneeded comments?

"clans are trash and this community is trash."

I am inclined to believe that statement is true, however I do not believe that the clan world is beyond repair. There does exist competent individuals in the clan world that have more than enough influence and power to make a positive change, the fact of the matter is, though, that these leaders seem to be 100% caught up in their own domestic agenda.

~am a cat meow~
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:38 PM
"crak how long did it take you to write this >______________>"

I got home like 15 minutes ago so about that? Maybe 10? Something like that.

~am a cat meow~
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Basketor is not online. Basketor
Joined: 06 Aug 2008
Total Posts: 55543
06 Jan 2015 05:40 PM
Well you make a valid point

But the thing is

VAK is always consistent

Sure looking at Pragmautist recycling clans over and over is annoying and boring

But in the C&G world a few things always remain consistent

FC

VAK

And the ability for C&G to hype anything into oblivion only for it to die in 2 months

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ShatteredQuantum is not online. ShatteredQuantum
Joined: 20 Aug 2012
Total Posts: 38600
06 Jan 2015 05:40 PM
you should feel shamed you took that long to write this :/
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VektrinCallic is not online. VektrinCallic
Joined: 21 Feb 2013
Total Posts: 11083
06 Jan 2015 05:44 PM
crak ily

can you like

just write forever so i can read your writings

the doc (ง ͠° ͟ل͜ ͡°)ง
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:44 PM
'But in the C&G world a few things always remain consistent'

If anything, Vaktovia is not a model of what clan consistency is, and perhaps you should first realize that consistency and progress are not synonymous. Pragmatic is a consistent leader, because he has, over the past few clans, demonstrating little change: he creates a hype clan, and that hype clan falls. That is expected of him, and in using the Merriam Webster definition (always acting or behaving in the same way), Pragmatic exhibits these qualities.

Vaktovia does not operate on consistence and seems to operate more on self-preservation. I am not going to comment on whether I believe this is good or bad, but Vaktovia's behaviors differ depending on its conflicts and its situations. Vaktovia has different visible actions when dealing with FC, TGI, and recently, CAT and the likes. I'd prefer to argue more tangible matters than meanings of words, but your argument is flawed in that respect, and I felt it necessary to point out.

~am a cat meow~
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waifupillow is not online. waifupillow
Joined: 21 Nov 2014
Total Posts: 3758
06 Jan 2015 05:45 PM
^^
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ezaiahs is not online. ezaiahs
Joined: 28 Jun 2011
Total Posts: 18613
06 Jan 2015 05:46 PM
ez: hey i have an idea on how to fi-
hr: NO
ez: what?
hr: i can do it myself
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:48 PM
'ez: hey i have an idea on how to fi-
hr: NO
ez: what?
hr: i can do it myself'

Domestic solutions wont do anything, nor is it likely that any change will come as the result of individual suggestions to leaders, largely due to, as you pointed out, inflated egos and whatnot. In my opinion, the only thing that will make change is a mediated discussion among influential leaders who are smart enough to see how cooperation can be beneficial to their own clans.

~am a cat meow~
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Corolis is not online. Corolis
Joined: 11 Oct 2014
Total Posts: 1428
06 Jan 2015 05:50 PM
This is quite an interesting thread you've made.

I would like to disagree with you, from where you said, "there are rarely new clans". I would like to point out that there are a lot of new clans coming around, where instead the leaders aren't experienced and neither are the members. In result, they do not get noticed positively. I am not trying to say that "they're bad" or "they're good", but I am rather trying to mention that the community will continue believe that "they're bad" until there is a capable leader (this is also why tons of leaders who are experienced keep repeating cycles and still have support).

I do believe that everything else you have put is quite accurate.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
06 Jan 2015 05:51 PM
is it time for the yearly "DAE clans r ded?!?!" post?
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:54 PM
"I would like to disagree with you, from where you said, "there are rarely new clans". I would like to point out that there are a lot of new clans coming around, where instead the leaders aren't experienced and neither are the members."

I suppose I should rephrase myself. There are very few new clans that are showing to be enduring and standing among clans of older ages. Many new clans that are created exist in their own sphere, outside of the clan world, and I am not including those in this discussion, simply because they are outside the 'clan world' that we consider ourselves a part of. I apologize for my lack of clarity, but I do believe that there are (now a days) very few /visible/ new clans with powerful leaders (save the new clans that are being led by longtime veterans, ASOV being an example.)

~am a cat meow~
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 05:56 PM
'is it time for the yearly "DAE clans r ded?!?!" post?'

I do not believe clans are dead, nor did I say anywhere in my thread that clans were dead. Simply that there exists evident stagnation, and that the clan community will /eventually/ unravel itself if left to the same conditions as the current. I do not believe in the past, nor now, clans have ever 'died', they have simply slowed down and have been caught up in the web that we have created with our newfound knowledge on politics.

~am a cat meow~
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Synoan is not online. Synoan
Joined: 31 Aug 2012
Total Posts: 15658
06 Jan 2015 05:58 PM
i agree with everything here

but you're in RAT you have no room to talk about how declining wars is bad
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
06 Jan 2015 05:58 PM
i agree for the most part though

the over-officiating is hurting clans.
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 06:03 PM
'i agree with everything here

but you're in RAT you have no room to talk about how declining wars is bad'

I have no say in how RAT handles its decisions, nor do I approve nor warrant its actions. I'm in the clan for the sake of being in a clan that offers an experience that's different, and I wanted to see how superclans operate.


~am a cat meow~
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Meercast is not online. Meercast
Joined: 09 Jun 2013
Total Posts: 7379
06 Jan 2015 06:03 PM
did i get the wrong message or are you saying something along the lines of we are the ones holding ourselves back
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Corolis is not online. Corolis
Joined: 11 Oct 2014
Total Posts: 1428
06 Jan 2015 06:04 PM
@Crakkity;

I agree with your rephrasing statements. I do think that we are chipping it down to a main point (in our individual discussion here), which I do think is a good decision on both of our behalves.

To add on, I do feel as if the visibility of these clans is determined by relevance and acceptance from the community of C&G (which isn't easy to get). If your clan is good, I do believe that it will have some form of relevance and acceptance, to where it is somewhat respected and is possibly able to move forward from there. Evidently, clans have been slowing down a bit, to the point where entertainment and enjoyment is almost rare to find in the same places as it had once been.
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MUMMYNOOB01 is not online. MUMMYNOOB01
Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Total Posts: 348
06 Jan 2015 06:06 PM
"As observed over the past few years, general opinion towards clan clans has increasingly gone south."
stoped reading so i could acknowledge the face that the south is bad.


"why are all of you egocentric idiots?" -Zealots | V401 Banned for a day.
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Crakkitty is not online. Crakkitty
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Total Posts: 17408
06 Jan 2015 06:06 PM
'did i get the wrong message or are you saying something along the lines of we are the ones holding ourselves back'

That would be correct. ROBLOX admins are staying for the most part out of clans, which is both good and bad. Good, because we're unrestricted and can act as we want. This is bad, though, when we fail to act, as we inhibit ourselves. At the moment, WE are the ones who are responsible for making clans decline. Clans have hardly changed, it's the way we handle situations that change, and if we want to make things work, we have to figure out a new way to put what we now know (political knowledge) to use in order to make the fundamental parts of clans (war, fun) actually happen.

~am a cat meow~
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