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| 06 Jul 2014 01:18 PM |
The following vote is for SS only. I will not count allies, enemies, or random kids in C&G. If you are not in SS, you can still post your opinion, but it will not be counted.
Shadow Syndicate,
As you know, the past few days have been hectic. I admit here and now, in case you haven't heard yet, that I did take Shadow Syndicate. No, I did not hack Kamenwati nor did I scam him into giving his pass-code.
Kamenwati gave me his pass-code in order to update and maintain the group places, fix bugs in scripts, etc. etc.
These are the reasons I took SS:
-I saw him treating members the opposite of how he preached.
-Ignored many PM's by members (As I was able to get into his account I have personal witness of this, seeing PM's come in but no response sent out).
-Claim wins that were not part of an official war.
-Instigate flame wars on forums, expect others to clean up the mess, then start new ones.
-Sending threats to Kragdor when he had SS as means to get it back. I'm not sure if Scorch actually sent any himself but I did receive some from his followers and I know he knew it was going on yet he did very little, if anything at all, to fix this.
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Given this, I still feel horrible for needing to do this. These past few days I haven't gotten much sleep at all because of this choice, but I'm torn.
The choice I have before me is keep SS and live with the guilt or giving it back and watching the same acts take place.
Shadow Syndicate, I have always said that I listen to my members and this rule is not ignored even in this case. I want to hear your opinions. Who do you want leading SS and why? Don't concern yourself about hurting anyone's feelings, I want your honest opinion in this.
I'll leave this forum up for three days. At the end of the third day I'll tally up the votes myself and go from there.
Kamenwati and his followers,
Since you failed to listen to me without interrupting multiple times and saying that I'm "disillusioned" or that I'm "lying to myself" before you even heard me out, allow me to explain myself below in an environment where I can't be interrupted. Maybe you'll listen this time:
Human beings are incapable of learning without punishments. This is basic psychology. If a three year old doesn't get burned when he puts his hand on a hot stove then he won't learn not to do it.
Now, I'm not calling Kamenwati a three year old but I am saying that he has his flaws as a leader.
"We all have flaws."
Has been a common response I received from many before being shouted at to give the group back without having a chance to explain.
Yes, we do all have flaws. Does this mean you sit back and accept them without doing anything to correct them? No. So the fact you're using this as a scapegoat to explain his flaws isn't reliable because it's the same as saying,
"Yes, he has issues, so what? Not like he's going to fix them so just let it go."
Is that really ok? A leader who knows his flaws yet does nothing to fix them?
Yes, Kame has gotten better from the past, but he still needs more growth. I talked with Kame a lot these past few days and one of the things he said was that the reason he did not follow the rules he set forth in SS was because SS wasn't ready for it.
I asked him if it was acceptable for a leader to not follow the rules he asks the rest of the group to follow simply because he feels the group isn't ready, furthermore how can a group not be ready for a leader to follow his own rules?
To that he simply said that the group wasn't ready for democracy.
One, democracy has nothing to do with a leader following his own rules. This is basic leading, if you want your followers to live by certain guidelines you must first embody these yourself. Second, if SS wasn't ready for democracy when he was in charge, why is it ready now? He's been asking for a vote in this situation, which is a democratic value, yet if SS wasn't ready for democracy then why would it matter?
So why did I do this? Kame has flaws as a leader yet he convinced himself the group wasn't ready for democracy, as he said himself. A leader with flaws who says his group isn't ready for democracy wouldn't listen to the people of his group so how would he accept any criticism of his leading?
"Why do you need criticism when leading?"
Kame is a prime example of why. If you exile those who oppose your views simply because you don't want to deal with them then the groupthink phenomenon takes place, that is, you surround yourself with people who think alike and therefore become closed-minded and have an inability to see your own faults.
Because of this, something had to be done. I decided that if he wouldn't listen to those below him then he would have to listen to one above him.
This is Kame's punishment for him to learn, this is his burn from the stove.
Kame,
I want you to post, calmly and without any insults, what makes you a good leader. I also want you to post every flaw you see in yourself and your plan to correct this. Explain what would happen to the members if you received SS back and what your new agenda would be. Prove to me that you're capable of leading and that you'll no longer disobey the rules you set forth and that you'll do better at finding your own faults by listening to the people.
You told me before you did listen to the people yet you then said that SS wasn't ready for democracy. You can't have both of these.
These past few weeks the only time I've seen you actually listen to the voice of SS was when you asked for their opinion on who should lead SS, in other words, I've only seen you listen to them when you can get something out of it beneficial.
Prove to me that you'll change, swear on the future of the group, and if SS votes so you'll have it back.
Shadow Syndicate and other C&G viewers,
I want to express my deepest apologies for these actions. As I said, I hated doing this and it'll take a long time for me to forgive myself, but it was needed for Kame to open his eyes to his own behavior.
"You cannot fight evil with evil, lest a greater evil emerges."
I failed to remember my own moral foundation when I did this and by doing so I did hurt numerous people, Kame included. I know you'll probably never forgive this but I do apologize for everything regardless.
SS,
The forum is now yours. Place your opinions on who you want leading. I always listen to the people and you are the group. I cannot and will not ignore the group speaking when it deals with their own future. No matter the outcome I will obey.
Prove, not only to me, but to Kame himself that you are ready for Democracy.
~Mydarkrai246~ |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:23 PM |
| You should own it, however you're screwed either way. If Kam emails roblox claiming you got into his account and stole his clan, then RIP. Upon logging into Kam's account your IP is now set in stone. Sorry to say, but you won't be owning it for long. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:26 PM |
| Then better to let the group vote on what happens then have it forcefully taken. I wont crap on my own personal values trying to fix someone else's, nothing will get accomplished that way. |
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Stoakle
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| Joined: 18 Feb 2014 |
| Total Posts: 26 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:28 PM |
I do not like the way you took it, but you did it for a reason. But I feel sorry for you. You are receiving hate and you have to play knowing that you could be terminated. Alongside that, some people might leave SS because of what you did.
Honestly, I didn't know Kamenwati was doing these things. So, I've been ignorant about what was going on, and that made me an easy target, until Sydwinx told me what had happened. I don't approve of what Kamen did to some people and her.
In conclusion, I think you're both in the wrong. Although you did it for what you and others believed in, you obtained the group in a way that isn't right. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:39 PM |
| I honestly don't really want to take sides here, even though I know both sides were at fault in a way. |
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Auzric
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| Joined: 13 Aug 2012 |
| Total Posts: 6397 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:42 PM |
My opinion will be given when kam replied.
Auzzie is going to check his YouTube subscriptions.
Laterz. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:48 PM |
| Can you make a short summary of all of this for stupid people like me? |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:49 PM |
I think it would be best if Scor did not regain leadership.
Sure, second chances are great, but I don't believe that Scor is willing to change his behaviors. During this last month or so of his leadership, I feel like we lost the family aspect of the group. There were many free promos, Scor wasn't following his own rules, he was unrightfully exiling and demoting members, and insulting people. He was not setting a good example. As Scor said in another forum, those who supported Mydark would be gone once he regained leadership, and I'm not looking forward to being forced to leave the group.
I think Mydark should lead. He has always been open to opinions other than his own, sets a good example, knows how to deal with people, and most of all, he is a genuinely nice person. The way that Mydark came about getting group wasn't right, but I feel as though it was necessary.
gl to both |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:51 PM |
| I want to see both sides, so I want to hear what kam says. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:53 PM |
| Kamenwati, the way you took the group was wrong, and in doing so you proved yourself a bad leader, although Kamenwati MAY have done the things you say, he's a better leader than you. |
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Stoakle
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| Joined: 18 Feb 2014 |
| Total Posts: 26 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:55 PM |
| Karen, I would be glad to leave a group that did not value my opinion, respected, or tolerated it. But SS can change. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:56 PM |
| Most of the HR's in Syd's era have left due to Scor. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:57 PM |
Some people might say that two wrongs don't make a right. But in this case, what Mydark did was for the greater good, not just for himself, but for SS as a whole. I vote for Mydark as I'd rather have Mydark as the leader far more than kame because I don't know if I can trust Kamenwati any longer after knowing what he's done and fear of he what he might do. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:58 PM |
@ShadowFear,
'..better leader than you'
Have you ever seen Mydark lead? |
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Stoakle
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| Joined: 18 Feb 2014 |
| Total Posts: 26 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:58 PM |
| I do agree with Karen. When I came out of my cave (retirement), I felt slightly out of place. I did make friends etc, but I felt that something (family) was awry. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 01:59 PM |
All of the current Officers minus Super have no leadership skill whatsoever. They didn't work towards it. All they had to do was attend a minimal amount of trainings and bam, they're an HR. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:00 PM |
| I have nothing but hateful thoughts towards you, mydark. What you did was 100% childish, and you should have left the situation alone. If you really want to lead so badly, atleast make your own group and do it yourself, not cause more drama by stealing someone else's. |
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Kamenwati
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| Joined: 25 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 2014 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:01 PM |
All the previous votes will be counted. Allies SHOULD count, considering we spent a lot of time with them.
http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=139325458
^ Those votes. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:01 PM |
| From what I've seen, Mydark has never had any ambitions to lead. He did this for the common good of SS. |
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Stoakle
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| Joined: 18 Feb 2014 |
| Total Posts: 26 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:03 PM |
@victor The point of being an Officer is to learn leadership skills and hone them. After us Officers are capable, we can advance. It wouldn't be a good idea to deny some people the right to try. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:03 PM |
| Cool thread. I support this. Clans are cool. |
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Kamenwati
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| Joined: 25 Jun 2007 |
| Total Posts: 2014 |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:03 PM |
| And it doesn't matter either way, MyDark. You stole SS NOT using democracy. Just pointing that out. |
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| 06 Jul 2014 02:04 PM |
| To confirm Karen's claims, I was one of the people Scor exiled for voicing my opinion...He's just not a good leader. He fails to improve himself and to assess the situations at hand and basically just lies in front of all our faces. I vote for mydark as well. SS needs a good leader and people have no idea how great mydark can potentially make this group. |
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