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| 08 Jun 2014 04:24 AM |
| "Koukl details the number of people killed in various events involving theism and compares them to the much higher tens of millions of people killed under atheistic communist regimes, in which militant atheism served as the official doctrine of the state.[1] It has been estimated that in less than the past 100 years, governments under the banner of communism have caused the death of somewhere between 40,472,000 to 259,432,000 human lives." |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
| Total Posts: 9418 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:25 AM |
| lold at lack of correlation |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:26 AM |
"it was called world war 1 & 2*"
Sorry, but I don't think any of those countries were communist when WWI started |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:26 AM |
| ye but he kinda quoted a text from a person who is obviously not in love and or doesn't like Atheism. so much bs |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:27 AM |
| only russia(back then soviet union) as I remember was communist. not sure about the rest of eastern europe. but west europe had no communism. |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:27 AM |
alright, let's be fair. Let's count the amount of people who have died under a state that has theism as it's official religion
continue with the roman empire, England, the imperalists in Africa, please. This post has no amount of research or comparison |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:29 AM |
| Exactly, much bs. The person who typed this out need to get statistics from every death that had something to do with theism. I can also just post something about (not in a racist way) that Christianity scammed millions of people with the church for money. Is that true? Not completely sure. But back when you wrote a book and you were bs. That later on in the future became history. |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:30 AM |
Stalin was atheist and killed around 60M people, not even counting the soldiers that fought under WWII, I'm talking JUST because of his poor leadership. I'm sure that's more than the crusades or the spanish inquisition ever killed.
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:30 AM |
| >governments under the banner of communism have CAUSED |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:30 AM |
| Eh can you get me actual statistics, in place of just assuming the amount of deaths? |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:34 AM |
@OP Seems like your beef is with communism, not atheism
@ other poster
We're talking every country ever to exist that had theism as its main religion. I'm sure you can rack up enough deaths from that to beat what, around 100 mil? |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:34 AM |
"Indeed, Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, the literary giant who wrote harrowingly about the Soviet gulag system, claimed the true number of Stalin’s victims might have been as high as 60 million."
60M is considered high though, I'll just copy and paste the entire thing:
"In February 1989, two years before the fall of the Soviet Union, a research paper by Georgian historian Roy Aleksandrovich Medvedev published in the weekly tabloid Argumenti i Fakti estimated that the death toll directly attributable to Stalin’s rule amounted to some 20 million lives (on top of the estimated 20 million Soviet troops and civilians who perished in the Second World War), for a total tally of 40 million.
''It's important that they published it, although the numbers themselves are horrible,'' Medvedev told the New York Times at the time.
''Those numbers include my father.''
Medevedev's grim bookkeeping included the following tragic episodes: 1 million imprisoned or exiled between 1927 to 1929; 9 to 11 million peasants forced off their lands and another 2 to 3 million peasants arrested or exiled in the mass collectivization program; 6 to 7 million killed by an artificial famine in 1932-1934; 1 million exiled from Moscow and Leningrad in 1935; 1 million executed during the ''Great Terror'' of 1937-1938; 4 to 6 million dispatched to forced labor camps; 10 to 12 million people forcibly relocated during World War II; and at least 1 million arrested for various “political crimes” from 1946 to 1953.
Although not everyone who was swept up in the aforementioned events died from unnatural causes, Medvedev’s 20 million non-combatant deaths estimate is likely a conservative guess."
Hell, even 5 million is WAY more than the amount of people theism has killed. You can't use the Roman Empire as an excuse, because they didn't go to war over their beliefs, it was over land. Spanish Inquisition and the crusades kill a couple thousand at most.
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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sonihi
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| Joined: 27 Jun 2009 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:36 AM |
| Are you kidding? THese people didnt kill in the name of Atheism. Atheism is just thinking there is no god. |
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Dystra
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:36 AM |
| russia was not the soviet union during WW1 lol |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:37 AM |
@Soni
Stalin's entire thing was that everybody should follow one cause. He abolished the church. He killed christians on sight. Were there other factors, sure, but if you can use theist leaders as justification for this post, why can't we use atheist leaders as justification to refute it?
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:39 AM |
"because they didn't go to war over their beliefs" 1. they kinda did go to war for their beliefs lol, that's the only reason people go to war
2. those people were fighting for communism, not atheism, and most of them probably didn't even belief in atheism in the first place
Btw you're kidding me right, the crusades killed like 5-6M people |
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Vercron
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| Joined: 18 Sep 2010 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:41 AM |
@Dystra
I never said when. I only said they were when Russia was the soviet union. And if you would then look at the time when Russia was the soviet union (USSR) then you would know that it was from the period of 1922 to 1991. |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:43 AM |
You're being hypocritical. Rome didn't fight Carthage over paganism, they fought with Carthage over Sicily. Rome didn't destroy Dacia because they had differing religions, they fought Dacia because Dacia was attacking their farms. I'm sure religion had a PART of it, but by no means was it the main point.
If you want to go ahead and say that, despite what I've just told you, it's still considered a "religious war", then why doesn't Stalin get to count? Sure, religion had no focal point in his murders most of the time, but he was still an Atheist murdering Theists, so it's perfect for this 'discussion' (Quotes are because anything involving religion is an argument, 100% of the time).
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:43 AM |
| "A popular image of the Nzs is that they were fundamentally anti-Christian while devout Christians were anti-NZi. The truth is that German Christians supported the Nzs because they believed that htlr was a gift to the German people from God. " |
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Arcarius
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| Joined: 28 Jul 2012 |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:44 AM |
| didn't stalin basically use the church as a weapon for propaganda |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:45 AM |
Sorry thought that last line of yours was your siggy and I didn't even bother to read it.
5-6M is still nowhere near the "conservative" estimate of 20M caused by Stalin.
As for the spanish inquisition, what does it say next to "Total Deaths" in this link?
http://en.wikipedia . org /wiki/Spanish_Inquisition#Death_tolls
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:46 AM |
First, when I said beliefs, I didn't mean necessarily religious. And the Roman Empire conquered thousands of miles of territory. Because their farms were being attacked. Right?
Secondly, with that argument, anytime a theist has killed an atheist, it counts too then, and an atheist a theist.
However, this entire argument is pointless and stupid. Like, it literally has no point besides spite. |
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| 08 Jun 2014 04:47 AM |
Nazs killed 6M, nor was it religiously motivated.
So that's 13M you have, still doesn't equal the *conservative estimate* of 20M from Stalin.
Just trying to make C&G non-toxic, one post at a time. -Olldeath, AKA me |
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