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Re: What do you think about unions?

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Midmyst is not online. Midmyst
Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Total Posts: 4803
13 Jan 2014 03:44 PM
I think they were and still are unnecessary burdens to employers and restrict business owners' freedom to hire, fire, pay, and work as much or as little as they want. Note that I'm not against unions completely; I do realize they have their function, but I think they're too corrupt, violent, bureaucratic and centralized. Unions in many states make workers pay dues to a union representing that business even if the specified worker is not a member of that union. Quite frankly, I think that's wrong. Not to mention how many unions will get a good teacher (for example) fired, but keep 10 so-so or even bad teachers employed. Union violence and corrupt union bosses are not uncommon; in fact they're pretty much the majority of union bosses. It's a disgrace. We need to restrict the power of the unions.
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russianarmy14 is not online. russianarmy14
Joined: 28 Nov 2012
Total Posts: 645
13 Jan 2014 04:10 PM
Socialism does not work in capitalist societies. I am a socialist.
It needs to be instilled first. Unions are burdens on everybody. It is quite annoying when I see "Shame on Rasing Kane's Chicken or whatever" Shame on Lexus of Omaha *Facepalm*
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 05:26 PM
not having collective bargaining isn't a choice
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JamesGalt is not online. JamesGalt
Joined: 01 Sep 2007
Total Posts: 13607
13 Jan 2014 05:31 PM
UNION of Columbia
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 05:45 PM
Unions should be legal to form but you should also be able to fire the union workers for doing such.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 05:46 PM
"you should also be able to fire the union workers for doing such."

why?
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Advertence is not online. Advertence
Joined: 06 Oct 2013
Total Posts: 1508
13 Jan 2014 05:48 PM
"UNION of Columbia"

He meant Financial Unions not Political Unions (Government).
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:13 PM
"you should also be able to fire the union workers for doing such."

why?
___
Because unions are harmful to businesses.
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:14 PM
Also because it is a job they voluntarily took and voluntarily agreed to get paid for the work they do. They agreed to certain terms voluntarily and an employer should be able to fire them for breaching such terms.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:14 PM
"Because unions are harmful to businesses."

not having unions have effectively removed collective bargaining in the US
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:15 PM
Adding on to that, it is an employers business and he should be allowed to hire whoever he wants and fire whoever he wants. He owns it, he has no duty to his employees but to keep with the terms he and they agreed to when the employees got hired.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:16 PM
"Adding on to that, it is an employers business and he should be allowed to hire whoever he wants and fire whoever he wants. "

so how does that exceed my right to associate and right to assemble
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:17 PM
not having unions have effectively removed collective bargaining in the US
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The government has a certain duty to it's citizens that it has to keep them safe, that includes workplace safety. Employers must make sure this safety exist. If the government did this, as it currently does, there is no need for a union but to get higher wages even though it is a job they voluntarily agreed to take for a certain pay.
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:18 PM
so how does that exceed my right to associate and right to assemble
___
I never said ban unions, I said a company should be allowed to fire people for forming them.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:20 PM
firing people for creating groups is still a breach of my rights
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:22 PM
A business is not a government.
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:24 PM
Since we are both Americans, I will go by the First Amendment for such a law.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Notice it is congress that cannot make a law abridging the right of assembly. A company is not a government.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:25 PM
if you allow businesses to do such, its no doubt that they will fire people for forming or joining unions, which then i can sue the state for negligence of discriminatory practice
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:29 PM
if you allow businesses to do such, its no doubt that they will fire people for forming or joining unions, which then i can sue the state for negligence of discriminatory practice
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It is not discriminatory, it is protecting a business. When you agree to work at a business, you sign a contact that you will work under certain conditions for a certain pay and do a certain amount of work. Nobody forced you to agree to such terms, you did it completely voluntarily. If the contract says that you cannot form a union, and you agree to sign that contract, then you cannot form a union. If you attempt to form a union, then you are in violation of the contract.
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:30 PM
To be more clear, joining a union when you sign a contract not to is a breach of contract which is against the law.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:35 PM
i'm not objecting to having to follow a contact

i don't agree that such contracts should exist that you can sign away the ability to join a union.

i don't get where you got "unions harm businesses" from. when practiced properly, collective bargaining with a trade union and a business benefits both people by having the business have their employees less likely to flee to other jobs and by protecting individual employees from corporations
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TheKentuckian is not online. TheKentuckian
Joined: 05 Sep 2008
Total Posts: 23547
13 Jan 2014 06:41 PM
i don't agree that such contracts should exist that you can sign away the ability to join a union.
___
Nobody is forcing you to sign it. If it is completely voluntary, then there is no reason to prohibit it.

i don't get where you got "unions harm businesses" from. when practiced properly, collective bargaining with a trade union and a business benefits both people by having the business have their employees less likely to flee to other jobs and by protecting individual employees from corporations
___
The US has over 7% unemployment rate. The ones who work for companies where unions are more "necessary" are the ones where workers are easily replaced.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:44 PM
"Nobody is forcing you to sign it. If it is completely voluntary, then there is no reason to prohibit it."

true, but a whole lot of corporations will include this as a condition in these contracts, which makes it easier for corporations to tyrannize their employees

there wont be anywhere to run from it if everyone will enact this.
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JamesGalt is not online. JamesGalt
Joined: 01 Sep 2007
Total Posts: 13607
13 Jan 2014 06:47 PM
If workers do feel that they are not gaining enough pay for their labor, they have the right to organize demand more in their salary and strike if necessary. Furthermore, the management also has the right to resist a union.
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coolmanownz is not online. coolmanownz
Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Total Posts: 10641
13 Jan 2014 06:49 PM
"If workers do feel that they are not gaining enough pay for their labor, they have the right to organize demand more in their salary and strike if necessary"


this is a great way to get fired
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