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| 13 Dec 2013 06:17 AM |
a fantasy rpg like tes and stuff but with no statistics whatsoever like statistics and mechanics still exist in the form of game code obviously but the player isn't told them at all and they have to discover them for themselves
so rather than you going to a blacksmith and sharpening your sword and having your weapon's attack stat rise by +3 to 13 attack, you have a sword and you go to the blacksmith and you sharpen your sword and then you have a sharper sword that you later find out is stronger and so you think 'oh, that's probably because i sharpened my sword' and you're not just told so by a bunch of numerical values
and attacking wouldn't just be clicking, you'd be able to do stuff like slashing and thrusting in different directions by slashing your mouse in a certain direction while left/right clicking (you'd be able to do a similar sort of push/deflect thing with a shield if you held down the block key while doing so)
and there wouldn't be any xp system for skills so you wouldn't do more damage with your sword or defend against more damage with your shield if you have a higher respective stat, the player has to physically learn the best way to block with their shield because there'd be variables like what angle you're blocking from and what angle the attack is coming from and whether they're using the sharp or blunt sides of a weapon (blunt side would push you back more) and stuff like that, but there'd still be an (invisible) xp system for stuff like health and stamina (the former of which would only regenerate VERY slowly btw, and they'd both be represented via audio like heavy breathing or visually like different animations and blood textures)
and each weapon and tool would handle differently so you'd spend a long time training with your little starter sword and then you'd steal the first boss's special demon sword but you'd realize that you have to attack differently because the blade carries more momentum and the hilt is shaped differently so your swift slashing and deflecting style of attack has to be replaced with a big bludgeoning style of attack and then you pick up the maractite sabre which is better used with quick thrusts because slashes are easily blocked because you don't have the momentum
and to learn magic you'd buy a magical tome but rather than learning an arbitrary spell which you can just bring up you'd have to open it up and learn the mouse movements that you have to perform to cast it, so to cast, say, a wind spell you'd hold the 'cast' key and draw a little wavy line with your mouse (~ like this) and then release the key to use the spell, and larger and more accurate versions of the shape would be more powerful so rather than levelling up a magic skill you'd physically learn how to draw the shape faster or larger or more accurately (magic would come out of your stamina btw)
and if you fight an enemy that seems undefeatable or at least very hard such as a DEVILBEE!!!! you wouldn't get an instant hint from an NPC or w/e saying 'try using this thing' you'd get a suggestion to study them so you'd go down to the library and you'd pick up a book that says 'Devilbee studies' and you'd read something that says 'Devilbees are allergic to the pollen of the Vanga flower, which is why they are rarely seen around Mildrew Town' and you'd go to mildrew town and collect vanga pollen and either coat yourself in it or make some sort of vanga pollen poison to coat your arrowheads with and you'd either be able to walk through them because they won't touch you or try and OHKO them with your crossbow, which would be good because they drop devilbee eyes which can be crafted down into devilbee lenses so you can make some sort of thermal or ultraviolet telescope or a thermal/ultraviolet scope for your crossbow
and the whole thing would just be very organic
which is a shame because it'll never get made with the current state of the industry |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:27 AM |
which is a shame because it'll never get made with the current state of the industry Thank goodness because this would never work. You can't simulate actual sword swings and momentum with a mouse, plus a lack of information isn't good. It's bad. When I play an RPG and go to a blacksmith I say, so hmph, if I spend 500 gold to sharpen my sword it does 1+ to attack. That sounds pretty good. In this game it's, okay so I spend 500 gold but what happens? Does my attack increase by 1? 2? Does it even increase my attack? You need to provide information on stuff like this. It isn't organic. It's a chore.
Also, the health and stamina thing? Bad idea. It's important to know just how much health you have, so you know when to heal or what not. In the middle of battle you're too busy fighting to pay attention to heavy breathing or a slightly red screen.
Also X2, this "organic" gameplay ruins any replayablitly when you can just figure out how to use every weapon in your first play through, then come back and destroy everything with this knowledge. RPGS need stats and levels to give you a feeling of proggresion.
This wouldn't work. |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:34 AM |
| you act like there aren't any popular games out there that don't give the player a clear indication of item value or damage, don't have a direct health/stamina bar or don'thave a progression system based on stats/levels |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:37 AM |
you act like there aren't any popular games out there that don't give the player a clear indication of item value or damage, don't have a direct health/stamina bar or don'thave a progression system based on stats/levels
That's because there aren't. Name at least one popular and good game that does this. |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:48 AM |
minecraft? without looking at a walkthrough you have no indication on how to play the game and have to learn via intuition. stronger materials also do more damage because they are stronger materials. enchanting with sharpness does more damage because it's sharper. that's a pretty popular game
cod 4: modern warfare? no health bars, if you take damage you get blood spatters and you can hear stuff like your heartbeat. that's also a pretty popular game i'd say given that it pretty much kickstarted an era of (admittedly repetitive) fps games just like it
again, minecraft? it has an xp system, yes, but it doesn't make you do more damage or take more hits or anything and your progress is based around world-building
also by the way why is a visual representation of your exact health at all times so important because i play skyrim with a mod that hides health + stamina bars and i find it perfectly easy to tell if i'm in trouble or not |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:49 AM |
| also if there was a single and popular game that did everything you find fault with then i wouldn't be suggesting the game would i because it would already exist |
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:54 AM |
minecraft? without looking at a walkthrough you have no indication on how to play the game and have to learn via intuition. stronger materials also do more damage because they are stronger materials. enchanting with sharpness does more damage because it's sharper. that's a pretty popular game
Expect the lack of instructions makes the game nearly unplayable without a wiki. You need one open in another tab until you learn the basic recipes. That's a chore.
cod 4: modern warfare? no health bars, if you take damage you get blood spatters and you can hear stuff like your heartbeat. that's also a pretty popular game i'd say given that it pretty much kickstarted an era of (admittedly repetitive) fps games just like i
That's not an RPG. in Cod 4 you are in shootouts and can simply duck behind cover to recover hp. In Rpgs you need to cast healing spells and drink potions, you also need to manage your mana supplies AND you stamina in battle. Doing all of that while desperately fighting for your life and without some representation of all of them in a melee is a chore.
again, minecraft? it has an xp system, yes, but it doesn't make you do more damage or take more hits or anything and your progress is based around world-building
? Don't see how this is related to your game.
also by the way why is a visual representation of your exact health at all times so important because i play skyrim with a mod that hides health + stamina bars and i find it perfectly easy to tell if i'm in trouble or not
Because without stats or numbers how are you supposed to know how much damage the enemy does to you. Did those 3 sword swings do 5 damage or 50? Do I heal now? That might be a waste of a health potion. It's a chore.
(Also I've seen a mod like that. It still brings the health and stamina bars back during combat. They are only hidden when not fighting.)
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| 13 Dec 2013 06:55 AM |
| There is a reason it doesn't already exist. |
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| 13 Dec 2013 07:06 AM |
'Because without stats or numbers how are you supposed to know how much damage the enemy does to you. Did those 3 sword swings do 5 damage or 50? Do I heal now? That might be a waste of a health potion. It's a chore.'
because at the beginning of the game you'd fight weak mooks who deal next to no damage and take, say, 5 hits to kill. then you do something which would imply that you do more damage and lo and behold you're killing them in 4 hits. so then you think 'this must mean that i can do more damage because they haven't gotten any weaker'. you don't CARE about whether it's +2 or +3 or +50 damage because you have no contextual numbers anyway and it equates to one less hit to kill them. and likewise you might meet a boss that can kill you in 5 strong hits and so you decide 'what if i try and block these hits?' and suddenly you find that you can take 15 hits!! and then you drink a health potion and your vision clears up a little, and then you drink a different health potion and your vision suddenly completely clears up and so you think 'i'm going to guess that the first one doesn't heal me much but the second one heals me completely' and then you find out that you're right because you take some damage that would normally have killed you then but your vision just returns to how it was before
the idea is that it's up to the player to make these decisions. the game doesn't tell the player 'your health is low', the player tells themselves 'my health might be low' and makes their own decisions of whether they want to spend a health potion or try and get past the enemy so they can escape back to the nearest town and get healed for free by resting up |
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| 13 Dec 2013 07:09 AM |
Alright. Let's play a game. You're an Rpg character. I'm an enemy. You have 50 hp
Attack Attack Attack Attack
I just attacked you four times. This is your first time fighting me. How much damage did I just do? You don't know. You're in the middle of trying to dodge my spells and attacks. Is the screen getting slightly blurry or are you imagining things? You don't have the time to check. Why don't you use a health potion an
OH Wait. Apparently I'm an awful enemy and did a total of 2 damage with those attacks. You only had 48 hp and used a health potion that heals 25. Good work! |
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| 13 Dec 2013 07:18 AM |
dude it wouldn't be 'your screen gets blurry as soon as you lose 2 HP' it would be more along the lines of 'you get knocked back a bit and make a noise to signify pain each time you take a hit but nothing much happens until you fall below 50% of your health at which point all the lasting visual and audio effects kick in'
so it would be more like
2 enemies. one attacks you 5 times and you know you get hit each time but you don't notice any visual effects. you kill the enemy and heal up with a weaker healing potion because you know you didn't take much damage from past experiences. then you go and fight the other enemy and after 4 hits your screen gets blurry and your character starts breathing heavily. now you know that this enemy does more damage! you knock the enemy back and pull out a stronger healing potion because you know you're low on health because of the fact that your screen is blurry and there's lots of very noticeable breathing. then you're back at full health and you know how strong that second enemy is in case you encounter them again
also i thought it would be implied that the effects of damage are noticeable because that's basically lesson 1 of how to make a game without a health bar |
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| 13 Dec 2013 07:28 AM |
also who says the concepts of health for an fps can't be carried over to an rpg
can you not compare blocking and retreating to a same distance to drink a healing potion to finding cover and waiting for health to recover? the only real difference is the kind of weaponry - for an rpg a ranged attack can ruin your retreat in the same way that in an fps an explosive weapon (such as an rpg, hehehe) can ruin your cover |
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| 13 Dec 2013 09:07 AM |
| People would meta like hell and read online about the game mechanics |
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Shovuc
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| Joined: 26 Aug 2013 |
| Total Posts: 5142 |
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| 13 Dec 2013 09:19 AM |
sigh
another rpg.
yay.
much bore. |
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| 13 Dec 2013 10:16 AM |
cool game idea
mage stop ur butthurtness
:)
~Russian Roulette~ |
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| 13 Dec 2013 10:38 AM |
"mage stop ur butthurtness" i second this |
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| 13 Dec 2013 12:21 PM |
Basically, this is about trial and error. You'll have to look online to find out stuff, and that should NOT be needed; all the information should be in the game. You don't know if something is going to be good, so then you try trial and error, WHICH isn't a good thing at all because you have no idea of what to do unless you go on the internet and check for yourself which you ALSO would not have to do as it defeats the point of not putting it in the game.
RPGs have stats for a reason, you know. |
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| 13 Dec 2013 12:49 PM |
an interesting idea for a "hardcore" rpg to say the least but when your attack system idea comes into actual game play, it'll look kinda like this:
http://www.roblox.com/Sword-Rave-Recreating-place?id=15483965
this isn't necessarily a bad thing but the slimes in the aforementioned place are impossibly hard to hit
on the bright side though, you'll feel like a total BA when you kill that final boss |
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| 13 Dec 2013 01:16 PM |
You basically just described what Chivalry: Medieval Warfare would be like if it was a RPG.
get rekt |
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| 13 Dec 2013 01:27 PM |
'You don't know if something is going to be good,'
well actually you're gonna know if something is gonna be good because it's going to be rare and look powerful this isn't the neopets school of weaponry if you see a set of ebony plate armor with flowing runes over it then you're gonna know it's probably better than a cloth hat in terms of defense |
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shan780
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| Joined: 16 May 2010 |
| Total Posts: 5217 |
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| 13 Dec 2013 01:48 PM |
shut up and take my money i want this to happen |
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SpySapper
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| Joined: 04 Jul 2012 |
| Total Posts: 8184 |
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| 13 Dec 2013 02:14 PM |
basically
elder scrolls: no gui edition
ill pass |
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MANTIS21
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| Joined: 12 Jan 2009 |
| Total Posts: 7123 |
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| 13 Dec 2013 03:47 PM |
" You can't simulate actual sword swings and momentum with a mouse,"
what do you mean
chivarly allows you to increase momentum with your mouse to do more damage |
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