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| 02 Jul 2013 10:37 PM |
Our raids, our crusades, and our events happen for the benefit of our members. We are a clan that encourages all of our members to participate in group events, and to be a part of the community no matter their skill level. Upon joining TGI/TAG, they are entitled to be a part of our raids, our defenses, and our group activities.
Bases such as Wagner counter these freedoms. They prohibit our members to join, and thus, take away from the entire point of why TGI raids.
Why does TGI raid?
We raid because we want to have fun. We raid because we want our members to be INVOLVED in fun and challenging raids. It would defeat the entire purpose of membership involvement by declaring war on Civil/raiding Civil. ---------------------------------------------------- except that this isn't true. if you wanted challenging raids you wouldnt be allied to the 3 groups that pose a threat to you. you're obviously trying to avert the attention from this
>But Crak, TGI has Gladiators!
We have the Gladiators, yes. However, that is not the point of the Gladiators. They Gladiators are elitists that are supposed to work with our other members, and represent us properly in legitimate final battles. When there is a raid for TGI, there is a raid for TGI. We do not have raids that are restricted to Gladiators. ------------------------------------------------------- well whose fault is that?
I do not see WIJ calling the Shock Troopers to raid clans to represent WIJ, that doe snot work. --------------------------------------------------- actually they do
>Hmph, well the 10v10 rule is just like FB's!
Yes, the 10v10 rule is like FB's. But Final Battles are one reason why this clan community is falling apart. With battles that represent a small portion of a clan, you cannot truly tell if it's the clan itself that is actually winning. ------------------------------------------ so you just said you fight in final battles now you're saying that you dont like them. contradiction
"Gladiators are elitists that are supposed to work with our other members, and represent us properly in legitimate final battles."
>But Crak, the above you said is impossible! FB's are called when both clans are tied!
Precisely why I disagree with the 10v10 rule at Wagner. They are FB's, without the legitimate reason for having an FB. --------------------------------------------- its a fair battle not a final battle. stop categorizing something under somwhere that it doesnt belong
>COWARDS!111
You should respect our decision to raid a clan that would not be in the best of our interests. ------------------------------------------------ there are plenty of clans that would help TGI grow like raiding WIJ or frostclan or VAK but instead you choose to ally 2 of them and refuse to fight the third because of some stupid summit that will probably just continue the deadlock |
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Dmoney433
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| Joined: 31 Dec 2010 |
| Total Posts: 3903 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:38 PM |
STs are always the first people to raid clans in the name of wij xd
-I like to be a tree, tree, tree, tree |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:39 PM |
It all came to me now.
-HICOM of VMO |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:40 PM |
"so you just said you fight in final battles now you're saying that you dont like them. contradiction"
Just because we fight in them doesn't mean we have to absolutely adore them or like them..
Caster Dane of Arcadia |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:41 PM |
| well fight you crak said they contribute to the downfall of the clan world so by that logic groups like TGI are bringing down the clan world |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:42 PM |
"except that this isn't true. if you wanted challenging raids you wouldnt be allied to the 3 groups that pose a threat to you. you're obviously trying to avert the attention from this"
I'm going to use WIJ as an example, because I know a lot of people have been commenting on that. WIJ actually extended the alliance to us during the WIJ/RAT war. We accepted their alliance, and we have been strong allies since.
"well whose fault is that?"
What do you mean who's *fault* is it? That's how we work.
"actually they do"
Really now? I haven't heard of anything of the sorts, unless you're talking about Final Battles. I could be misinformed, but I was under the impression that all of WIJ are involved in raids.
"so you just said you fight in final battles now you're saying that you dont like them. contradiction"
I don't think you understand. Final Battles are done when clans are very close to tying in war. For Wagner, it forces a *final battle* situation where one is not warranted.
"its a fair battle not a final battle. stop categorizing something under somwhere that it doesnt belong"
I'm actually using a quote from Dini earlier. His reasoning for having 10v10 was "because it was like a FB" or something of the likes.
"there are plenty of clans that would help TGI grow like raiding WIJ or frostclan or VAK but instead you choose to ally 2 of them and refuse to fight the third because of some stupid summit that will probably just continue the deadlock "
I already talked about WIJ above, and Frost Clan have been our friends from the beginning.
Our alliances with Frost Clan and others extend from the beginning, and with WIJ; the same.
We do not break our alliances just to find a new enemy.
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:44 PM |
"well fight you crak said they contribute to the downfall of the clan world so by that logic groups like TGI are bringing down the clan world"
If you'd pay attention to our previous statements, we pretty much disallow final battles at this point because they bring an early end to wars.
This was basically established after this last Stonemen FB, one reason why we're not going with a match against Platinum Spade.
If we involve ourselves with Final Battles, it would mean that we would have a really close war with another group, which in that case, the Final Battle would be warranted. |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:45 PM |
"except that this isn't true. if you wanted challenging raids you wouldnt be allied to the 3 groups that pose a threat to you. you're obviously trying to avert the attention from this"
I'm going to use WIJ as an example, because I know a lot of people have been commenting on that. WIJ actually extended the alliance to us during the WIJ/RAT war. We accepted their alliance, and we have been strong allies since. ------------------------------------------------------------------- you accepted it which was mistake #1
i denied sleet clan/TSG's alliance like 3 times because i was planning to fight then. it really doesnt matter who proposed it
"well whose fault is that?"
What do you mean who's *fault* is it? That's how we work. -------------------------------------------------------------- so then you have no right to complain about it if you're the one causing it
"actually they do"
Really now? I haven't heard of anything of the sorts, unless you're talking about Final Battles. I could be misinformed, but I was under the impression that all of WIJ are involved in raids. --------------------------------------------------- nope WIJ opens up wars with ST raids
i've seen them raid SMO, borealis, etc
"so you just said you fight in final battles now you're saying that you dont like them. contradiction"
I don't think you understand. Final Battles are done when clans are very close to tying in war. For Wagner, it forces a *final battle* situation where one is not warranted. ------------------------------------------------- but you just said you didnt like doing final battles
"its a fair battle not a final battle. stop categorizing something under somwhere that it doesnt belong"
I'm actually using a quote from Dini earlier. His reasoning for having 10v10 was "because it was like a FB" or something of the likes. ---------------------------------------------------------- "like" is the key word here. it is not a final battle
"there are plenty of clans that would help TGI grow like raiding WIJ or frostclan or VAK but instead you choose to ally 2 of them and refuse to fight the third because of some stupid summit that will probably just continue the deadlock "
I already talked about WIJ above, and Frost Clan have been our friends from the beginning.
Our alliances with Frost Clan and others extend from the beginning, and with WIJ; the same.
We do not break our alliances just to find a new enemy. ---------------------------------------------------------- then why did you ally them in the first place
oh probably because you're afraid they can beat you |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:46 PM |
To long for me to read,
#Dumbass
#iyess |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:47 PM |
If you'd pay attention to our previous statements, we pretty much disallow final battles at this point because they bring an early end to wars. ------------------------------------------------ but you say that gladiators are for FB's?????
This was basically established after this last Stonemen FB, one reason why we're not going with a match against Platinum Spade. ------------------------------------------------- i really dont care actually
If we involve ourselves with Final Battles, it would mean that we would have a really close war with another group, which in that case, the Final Battle would be warranted. ----------------------------------------------- fair enough however that seems counterproductive to trying to use FBs less and less |
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ToberDam
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| Joined: 08 Oct 2008 |
| Total Posts: 11054 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:47 PM |
"except that this isn't true. if you wanted challenging raids you wouldnt be allied to the 3 groups that pose a threat to you. you're obviously trying to avert the attention from this"
Yes but we want it challenging for the members who are not super psycho elitists who know things like interpolation, or learning the dos and don'ts so well it's the back of your hand. We allied people not because they posed a threat to us, but because well, we wanted to ally with them. WiJ approached us, we got along with people. Simply because we are a self proclaimed war clan doesn't mean we should punch everything in the throat first chance we get.
"well whose fault is that?"
Does it matter?
"actually they do"
Yup
"so you just said you fight in final battles now you're saying that you dont like them. contradiction
'Gladiators are elitists that are supposed to work with our other members, and represent us properly in legitimate final battles.' "
Simply because we do not like them doesn't mean we won't partake in them. This is not a contradiction. We have a final battle team in case of an unexpected necessity.
"its a fair battle not a final battle. stop categorizing something under somwhere that it doesnt belong"
He was using it as an example argument that people could make. We have already acknowledged the fact that wagner is fair.
"there are plenty of clans that would help TGI grow like raiding WIJ or frostclan or VAK but instead you choose to ally 2 of them and refuse to fight the third because of some stupid summit that will probably just continue the deadlock"
Aside from the assumption of the summit, yes, there are plenty of clans. But I think we're growing just fine. |
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Dinizterz
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| Joined: 08 Oct 2008 |
| Total Posts: 4193 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:48 PM |
Thanks. But honestly, -------V > 10 v 10 < --------^ What the hell is wrong with that?! WHAT?! |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:49 PM |
im only addressing tober's last point since i pretty much did his other points in the response to crak
Aside from the assumption of the summit, yes, there are plenty of clans. But I think we're growing just fine. ------------------------------------------- was in not you that said TGI is falling now after it had reached its prime awhile ago? |
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ToberDam
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| Joined: 08 Oct 2008 |
| Total Posts: 11054 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:50 PM |
| @Sasuke: No. I had stated that I had a fear of reaching a prime if we engaged and beat VAK. |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:51 PM |
| no i clearly remember you saying you passed TGI's golden age |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:51 PM |
guys don't listen to a hooded guy.
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:51 PM |
"you accepted it which was mistake #1
i denied sleet clan/TSG's alliance like 3 times because i was planning to fight then. it really doesnt matter who proposed it"
We accepted that alliance because it opened up activity for us. That activity was found in defending our WIJ allies from RAT, and looking back, that's exactly what it did.
"so then you have no right to complain about it if you're the one causing it"
I'm not complaining about anything. I'm stating that we work off membership involvement, and we're not going to get involved in a base which restricts that.
"nope WIJ opens up wars with ST raids
i've seen them raid SMO, borealis, etc"
Thank you for clarifying that for me, but during the RAT war, all of WIJ raided Borealis.
"but you just said you didnt like doing final battles"
You're right, I did say that. We don't like FB's because they are often unwarranted. If they were - however, warranted (as in a clan got similar raid wins) we would use them.
The main reason why we oppose FB's is because they negate raid-wins and bring early-ends to clan wars. If a clan ties in raid wins with us, the negation of raid-wins is accepted.
""like" is the key word here. it is not a final battle"
But it's similar to one in structure, which is what I'm trying to say here. We won't be restricting our members. I keep saying this - because that's the pinnacle reason as to why we won't involve ourselves with Civil.
"then why did you ally them in the first place
oh probably because you're afraid they can beat you"
We allied them because they would open new opportunities to be involved in new conflicts, and engage ourselves with a variety of people.
Our allies have helped expand our influence, and they have helped us in times of hardship. In turn, we do the same.
Our allies are not playthings, nor are they shields to which we hide behind. We assist our allies in times of need, which opens us to the opportunity of wide conflicts, something that this clan world is severely lacking at the moment. |
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ToberDam
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| Joined: 08 Oct 2008 |
| Total Posts: 11054 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:52 PM |
| @Sasuke: Please provide the thread of me saying such so that I may put my foot in my mouth. |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:53 PM |
| tober wheres your plain t-shirt? |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:54 PM |
"Thank you for clarifying that for me, but during the RAT war, all of WIJ raided Borealis."
actually you're wrong
the whole war opened up with a ST raid on borealis held by owen0202
he even has a screenshot, and i will ask for it when he logs on |
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Vatreus
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| Joined: 02 Mar 2013 |
| Total Posts: 2874 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:54 PM |
As an External Affairs lord. I find your reasoning of TGI being afraid of our allies is because we're allied with WIJ which has remained undefeated in Final Battle Wars, as well as us. Frost Clan is just as influential as TGI, same for UAF. In all honesty, our Allies are just fine the way they are. We're all around the same level of inflence/skill/culture/etc.
- Imperial Lord Vatreus J. Nevermoor |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:55 PM |
TO LONG TO READ BUT... SUPPORT111 |
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| 02 Jul 2013 10:55 PM |
I'm talking about throughout the duration of the war. I'm not talking about the raid-opening.
The problem with Civil, is that if we were involved in a conflict with them, it would only be the Gladiators raiding, because that's how that fort is set up.
For RAT, WIJ did not have to use the shock troopers every time they raided. |
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